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Thread: Have I lost my mind?

  1. #1
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    Have I lost my mind?

    I am half considering getting a .25 auto. The little things conceal so easily I could have one while jogging comfortably. Is .25 auto really that bad or is it just a bunch of gunstore talk and it will kill you equally dead as any other gun. I've seen what a .22 can do to a person and that is smaller than .25acp. Tell me all of your .25 auto horror stories or tales of failure to penetrate. I DO NOT WANT ANYTHING OTHER THAN FIRST HAND ACCOUNTS.
    I aim to misbehave.

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  2. #2
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    Sorry He Can't Speak for Himself...

    ...but my friend succumbed to lung cancer over a decade ago so you'll have to take this one second-hand:

    While heading up a small unit that hunted down Category 2 war criminals (such as POW camp commanders who had perpetrated atrocities, concentration camp commanders, etc.) in post-VE Day Germany, my friend was in the process of arresting an SS officer. The guy made as though he was reaching into an inner jacket pocket to produce his papers. Instead, he drew a .25 Auto and shot my friend in the head. Decades later, my friend had to wear his caps either low or high on his head, due to a small neuroma right where the band of the cap would sit if he wore it at the normal angle. The bullet failed to penetrate the skull and did not keep him from shooting the arrestee.

  3. #3
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    No..! You haven't lost your mind! Mouseguns have an incredible appeal that many here at THR won't admit to succumbing to.
    That being said, a .25ACP certainly isn't the most potent piece to carry if one can carry something just eas easily that is more so, such as a .32, or .380ACP. But, if it's what you can easily carry while doing everything you plan to be doing, and can hit with in a stressful situation, then it beats the .45 you left back home.
    I admit to dropping my .22LR in my pocket when climate dictates a low enough level of clothing to make my Thunder .380 or CA Undercover impractical to carry. Fortunately, that's not very often.
    I'd recommend if you get a single-action striker-fired mousegun, don't carry it with a round in the chamber, since that would mean it's cocked. If you do get a SA gun, try to get one with an external hammer that can be lowered, then thumb-cocked for firing. Then, you could presumably carry with one in the pipe, as it takes less to thumb-cock to fire than to rack the slide.

  4. #4
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    Have I lost my mind?
    Well, If you have to ask...


    Just Kidding!
    In reality, a gun on your person beats a gun in your safe any day!

  5. #5
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    It's better than nothing.


    C

  6. #6
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    I like my little .25. It is the gun I carry when it would be just as easy to not have one. I usually carry a 1911, I have my Chief's Special for those times something a little smaller seems appropriate, and the diminutive .25 just fills in as a pick up piece for those moments; like the dog needs to go out at 4 am, or you need to run out to the mailbox real quick. It is nice having something that will fit into the pocket of a t shirt, or can be dropped into a pac boot. Beats stumbling into a gun fight with just a rock.
    "An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life."
    Robert A. Heinlein

  7. #7
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    .25 ACP? Yes, in my opinion, you have lost your mind.

    I say this simply because, in the world that I live in, for $275 you can buy a brand new .32 Auto which weighs 6.6 ounces and holds eight rounds, or a .380 which weighs 8.3 ounces and holds seven rounds. Both of these are about the size of a McDonald's hash brown after you add a clunky laser to them.

    Why try to legitimize a caliber when you can get a more powerful mousegun that isn't any bigger or heavier?

    I was speaking, of course, of the Kel-Tec P32 and P3AT. Even in swim trunks I could conceal one. Do you have some more "revealing" occasion which needs an even more concealable gun?

  8. #8
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    I agree that a keltec .32 is as small mostly and is likely a better substitute for the .25

    I have a p32 and it is light enough that even around the house in just a bair of briefs the little keltec in an cheapie uncle mikes hoster does not fall down.

    If size is the real issue for ya compare them. I have a couple .25's but don't much use them- not that I would not- I just have better available and they are buried in the recesses of storage.

  9. #9
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    I'd say go look at the Ruger LCP . . . .I love mine and I can't imagine how anyone would have trouble concealing one. Loaded with Speer Gold Dot .380 ACP I think it'd make a pretty good weapon if you got into a situation that was up close and personal. It wouldn't be my first choice, but it's a heck of alot better than a pointed stick.

  10. #10
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    25 acp

    when I was growing up there were hundreds/thousands of 25 cal pistols around.I did not have to go to a gun store.hit right a 25 is bad medicine and even now in my area they do damage[kill].the British took the 38 S&W to war.I carry a 25 Ortega from time to time.most shootings the shooter shots many rds and does not hit anything.

  11. #11
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    Is .25 auto really that bad or is it just a bunch of gunstore talk and it will kill you equally dead as any other gun.
    A nasty infection will kill you, it will just take a while. The issue isn't that a .25 can't stop an attacker, its about the speed of doing so.
    Every social movement (*snip*) that tries to break the bonds of mindless convention and tradition and that defies established privilege gets accused of being rude and worse, much worse, and there are always weak apologists for the status quo who use that pathetic etiquette excuse to try and silence the revolutionaries. Successful revolutionaries ignore the admonitions about which fork to use for their salad because they care only to grab the steak knife as they launch themselves over the table. -- Richard Dawkins

  12. #12
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    I was looking at some used .25 autos yesterday at the shop. There are some tiny little suckers in there. Smaller than my Keltec.

    They would be fun to have just to have... I don't think I would carry anything smaller than my .32 Keltec regularly though.
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  13. #13
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    I had a customer in my shop one day tell me how he shot and killed 2 men with a .25. He wasn't bragging either.
    I have a little Colt 1908 or whatever the early hammerless model was. Great little gun, real cute.
    I wouldn't recommend one for carry but they are better than nothing. And no one wants to stand in front of one.

  14. #14
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    Mixed feelings about the real small calibers.

    There is instance after instance (some even mentioned here) where the .25 didn't penetrate, etc. However, the same can be said of even some of the most effective handgun rounds as well. There was a case in Colorado Springs several years ago where the son of a police officer (I think) shot his dad square in the chest with a .357 Mag. Apparently the bullet didn't penetrate and only left a nasty bruise. Dad was able to run next door and call 911.

    I carry a P3AT quite often. I prefer a small .45 or 9mm but the KT is much easier to conceal. I think I'd rather have a .380 than a .25.

    On the other hand, after 15 years in LE and seeing several (maybe 150 - 200???) people shot by various handgun rounds, of those that survived, which is the overwhelming majority, I never heard any of them complain of being shot with too small a caliber. Most just did not want to get shot again and getting shot really changed their attitude about continuing whatever it was that got them shot in the first place.

    I think as long as a guy understands the limitations of handguns in general, and smaller calibers specifically, this isn't a real big issue. If that's all I had or all I could afford, I'd carry one over nothing at all.

    I've always thought for a lot of people who couldn't stand much recoil or didn't have the strength to operate a semi-auto a light weight revolver in .22lr or .22WMR would be a great defensive gun.
    NRA Patron Member - Rides: '06 FLHTP Shoots: Colt Ser 70/Colt 6520 Carries: Colt Defender Drinks: Buffalo Trace Status: Still married to my ex-girlfriend

  15. #15
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    Just between you me and the fence post I'd feel more confident with a 22LR. Last summer a woman shot a male intruder with her 25 and killed him with 1 shot, a few years ago a man not far from me had to defend himself from his abusive father and put 5 shots into his forehead, every bullet bounced off. It is just flat out underpowered and I would suggest nothing less than a 32, preferably a 32 magnum or better yet a 380. I'd rather not shoot anybody but if I do I want a bullet that won't bounce off heavy bones.
    1934 National Firearms Act, 1968 The Gun Control Act, 1986 Firearms Owners Protection Act, 1993 Brady Handguns Violence Act, 1994 Assault Weapons Ban, 1995 Gun Free School Zones Act, NO MORE COMPROMISING

  16. #16
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    Yeah, there's been more ammo development in .22LR defense rounds than in .25. So if you MUST have a gun in that size class, you want the .22. Load CCI Stingers or maybe the Remmington Yellowjacket.

    That said, the jump to 32ACP takes you a good ways up the power chain. 380 even moreso.

    And a small fanny pack with a 38Snub will git'r'done real good.

    On edit: one more possibility: the king of mousegun power (under 380 at least) is the NAA Black Widow loaded with CCI MaxiMag +V 22Magnums. Quick as hell on the first shot, and makes BIGtime noise like you've set off a .357.
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  17. #17
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    One other thing... .25ACP ammo is really expensive! At least around here it's as much as .40SW or the good 9mm stuff.
    NRA Patron Member - Rides: '06 FLHTP Shoots: Colt Ser 70/Colt 6520 Carries: Colt Defender Drinks: Buffalo Trace Status: Still married to my ex-girlfriend

  18. #18
    Alas, the sectional density of a typical 70 grain 32ACP load is notably below that of the 40 grain 22LR or the 50 grain .25. I think the heaviest, hottest FMJ is the way to go with any of these.

    Be that as it may, a P32 nearly invisible in the pocket and thus always available, is a wonderful thing.

  19. #19
    here was a case in Colorado Springs several years ago where the son of a police officer (I think) shot his dad square in the chest with a .357 Mag. Apparently the bullet didn't penetrate and only left a nasty bruise. Dad was able to run next door and call 911.
    How could this possibly happen?

    Was the officer wearing a vest?
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  20. #20
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    Just to reassure everyone I normally carry a J frame S&W. The Kel-Tec really doesn't add much more concealment for a lack in firepower. .22s and .25s are just freaking small! However .22 is a rimfire and has reliability issues. I think the .25 NAA chambered in a small auto would be awesome if such a thing was available for under $300.
    I aim to misbehave.

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  21. #21
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    I really like my NAA Mini-Revolver in .22wmr. Different strokes, of course, but it's something to consider. I'm virtually never without it, and with a Dark Sun clip grip I almost forget it's there.
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  22. #22
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    I like mine, I have a Browning and a Model 21 Beretta. I can promise that absolutely nothing conceals like the Baby Browning.

    Hornady and Speer both load a 35 gr. bullet now at over 900 fps, that's what I keep in both of mine.
    Browningguy
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  23. #23
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    I carried the Browning .25 for maany years where I wasn't supposed to have a firearm, but needed protection anyway. I dropped it in the breast pocked of my denim jacket and forgot about it until i needed it.

    It took care of several rabid skunks, one coyote, bunches of rabbits and, once, made an unfriendly fellow decide he needed to find a different woman to beat up.

    Pops
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  24. #24
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    Here it goes : the .25ACP in gelatin.

    Block calibrated at 9.4cm and 593 ft/s
    Firearm was 2.4" barrel recoil-operated semi-auto

    Shot 1 - Remington UMC 50 gr MC. Impacted at 807 ft/sec and penetrated to 14.0". Recovered diameter was 0.250".

    Shot 2 - Hornady 35 gr XTP JHP. Impacted at 931 ft/sec and penetrated to 6.7". Recovered diameter was 0.369".
    Above from Brass Flecture

    Another jell test 25 ball went 16" Remember FBI say 12"
    I carry a 25 at times and drew one once in a parking garage. Guy with pocket knife decided he didn't need my wallet.
    I only use ball ammo. in all 5 of my 25 autos.
    Colt LTW Commander, Colt Defender, , Colt Mustang DW bobtail,1973 S&W Mod 49 ,PPK/S,Bersa 380

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  25. #25
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    And for the 22 mag people Those little NAA in 22 mag push a lighter bullet in some cases a little faster than a 25. But I can aim fire all 9 of my 25's from my Beretta before you can do 3 aimed shots with yours. Here numbers from NAA site I'll keep my 25 auto.

    http://www.naaminis.com/magvel.html
    Colt LTW Commander, Colt Defender, , Colt Mustang DW bobtail,1973 S&W Mod 49 ,PPK/S,Bersa 380

    You must learn to be.....Slow in a Hurry Wyatt Earp 1849-1929

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