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Thread: Open Carry Win in Wisconsin

  1. #1
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    Open Carry Win in Wisconsin

    West Allis man not guilty in open carry gun case
    By Linda Spice of the Journal Sentinel

    Posted: Feb. 17, 2009 12:26 p.m.

    A West Allis municipal judge today ruled in favor of a local man arrested for disorderly conduct after a neighbor complained that he was carrying a gun while planting a tree.

    Judge Paul Murphy found Brad Krause not guilty of disorderly conduct in a case that drew to a hearing numerous gun rights advocates to witness what may be the first open carry gun case heard in a Wisconsin courtroom.

    For Krause, however, the significance of the case extended beyond gun rights: It was an infringement on civil liberties, he said after today's decision.

    "The reason people are upset about this is it's not about guns. It's about civil liberties. And we obviously have a property issue. There was no warrant issued, no exigent circumstances, no permission to enter the property, yet the police stormed in with guns drawn and put my life at risk," Krause said. "My wife was very worried that she would be a widow in short order because I was planting a tree."

    West Allis Police Chief Mike Jungbluth could not be reached for comment this afternoon.

    West Allis Assistant City Attorney Jenna Merten, who prosecuted the case, was in trial today and was unavailable for comment. City Attorney Scott Post declined to comment because he had not yet learned the basis for the judge's decision, he said.

    West Allis police responded to Krause's home last August after a neighbor called to ask about the legality of him openly carrying a gun in a holster on his property. Police responded, arrested Krause and ticketed him for disorderly conduct, an offense he and his attorney, Steven Cain, fought during a court trial in December. Police also seized his gun.

    Cain said today, "The big overarching issue is whether open carry is legal. The law in Wisconsin really only limits concealed carry. The law in Wisconsin, as we see it, is that open carry is absolutely legal, protected, and should be."

    Cain argued that the U.S. Supreme Court last summer in the case of D.C. vs. Heller concluded that open carry is "an individual right that shouldn't be abridged by law enforcement. That's what the case is generally all about."

    In explaining why he was carrying a gun while planting a tree, Krause said, "There's no requirement to justify why you're able to exercise constitutional rights. I and everyone else are able to go to church, they're able to vote, they're able to speak their mind. Even though the city might not like it, we have that right."

    The case is also one that has been watched closely around the country, particularly by the co-founders of the Virginia-based OpenCarry.org, John Pierce and Mike Stollenwerk.

    Said Pierce: "Really, the larger issue is not even a gun rights issue. It's the issue of having a disorderly conduct statute that is a catchall statute for otherwise legal behavior."

  2. #2
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    I'm glad it went down this way, and I hope he reams the city bigtime: assault, false arrest, false imprisonment, violations of civil rights, the works. Make 'em pay.
    Jim March
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    I wonder how relations are between him and his sanctimonious, smug prick of a neighbor.
    Too many people {trade} rights {for} morality. I am certain that everyone here wants to live in a moral society. But, if you are going to live in a free society, you have to be willing to let people corrupt themselves. -- paraphrased from Sheik Yerbouti

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    after a neighbor complained that he was carrying a gun while planting a tree.
    West Allis police responded to Krause's home last August after a neighbor called to ask about the legality of him openly carrying a gun in a holster on his property.
    Was the neighbor being a prick or not?
    IANSA is the enemy.

    "If someone is so fearful that they are going to start using their weapons to protect their rights, it makes me very nervous that these people have weapons at all." ~~Henry Waxman

  5. #5
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    Was the neighbor being a prick or not?
    Here's a big vote for "prick."

    I don't like all my neighbors, but I don't make a routine out of calling the police to inquire as to the legality of their actions that don't directly affect me
    If you ever crawl inside an old hollow log and go to sleep, and while you're in there some guys come and seal up both ends and then put it on a truck and take it to another city, boy, I don't know what to tell you. - Jack Handey

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    Well actually, the way I heard it the neighbor was just asking to see if it was legal, NOT "complaining" in any way shape or form.

    In fact, to his credit the neighbor was a witness at the trial explaining that he never felt threatened, and that he never had a problem with the packer. Given that, I'd say he was sorry he ever opened his trap and speaking up in court would have gone a long way in my book at making up .
    Jim March
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    I'm glad it went down this way, and I hope he reams the city bigtime: assault, false arrest, false imprisonment, violations of civil rights, the works. Make 'em pay.
    It is certainly good that he was acquitted. While he probably has grounds for a law suit, it's too bad that the people actually responsible for his arrest and prosecution won't pay. The only people who will pay will be the tax-payers.

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    It is certainly good that he was acquitted. While he probably has grounds for a law suit, it's too bad that the people actually responsible for his arrest and prosecution won't pay. The only people who will pay will be the tax-payers.
    Not if he files *criminal* charges. (I think the FBI is the proper agency, or perhaps the state police)
    "Nobody wins in a Dairy Challenge" —Kenny Rogers

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    In fact, to his credit the neighbor was a witness at the trial explaining that he never felt threatened, and that he never had a problem with the packer. Given that, I'd say he was sorry he ever opened his trap and speaking up in court would have gone a long way in my book at making up
    Good point, didn't realize that part
    If you ever crawl inside an old hollow log and go to sleep, and while you're in there some guys come and seal up both ends and then put it on a truck and take it to another city, boy, I don't know what to tell you. - Jack Handey

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    Today's Milwaukee Journal Sentinel adds:

    Meanwhile, the West Allis Deputy Police Chief said Tuesdays verdict will not change the way his officers respond to similar calls, noting they must assess all calls on a case-by-case basis, particularly when a gun is involved.

    Violence is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and valorous feeling which believes that nothing is worth violence is much worse. Those who have nothing for which they are willing to fight; nothing they care about more than their own personal safety; are miserable creatures who have no chance of being free, unless made and kept so by the exertions of those better than themselves. Gary L. Griffiths, Chief Instructor, Advanced Force Tactics, Inc. (Paraphrasing John Stuart Mill)

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    Sounds to me like everyone in Wisconsin who owns a firearm should open carry tomorrow in celebration!

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    the neighbor was a witness at the trial explaining that he never felt threatened, and that he never had a problem with the packer
    ...until now!
    "If you got to shoot, shoot! Don't talk!" -Tuco Ramirez"

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