Page 1 of 5 12345 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 116

Thread: The "lessons" of the horrible attack in Norway...

  1. #1
    Administrator   
    Join Date
    11-19-03
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    13,086

    The "lessons" of the horrible attack in Norway...

    A gunman/bomber kills 7 and destroys large portions of city blocks in Oslo, then, disguised as a police officer, attacks a youth political camp and kills 80 there with a possible automatic weapon and a victim reported shotgun. What does CNN say are the lessons of this attack?

    http://www.cnn.com/2011/OPINION/07/2...html?hpt=hp_t1

    The increasing availability of automatic weapons makes mass killing easier, even by a single individual....firearms are increasingly a weapon of choice for terrorists; reasonable restrictions on the sale and distribution of automatic weapons make sense
    Norway has very tight regulations and restrictions on any firearms posession by ordinary Norweigans, IIRC, so this irresponsible attack on firearms freedoms is just the waving of the bloody shirt, jumping on the tragedy to push a political objective. Sounds like a shill for the UN ATT treaty being prepared.
    *sigh* I should know better, but sometimes I can't help but wonder at the gall of some people. Perhaps trying to find out where he got the guns, and how to get the people who sold/provided him illegal firearms might be a better tactic.


    (really unprofessional comment edited out)
    If total government control equals safety, why are prisons so dangerous?

    http://czforumsite.info/

  2. #2
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    06-19-08
    Location
    Midwest
    Posts
    1,783
    They are still counting the bodies in Norway, and it is probably unseemly to start making political points. I haven’t seen any information about the apparent perpetrator, so his motivations (if any, other than insanity) are unknown at this point. But one observation seems to be in order; no doubt, it has already been made by many others.

    What happened on Utoya island was that the murderer, dressed as a policeman and heavily armed, took a boat to the island, ordered teenagers to assemble around him, and started shooting. His rampage continued, as I understand it, until a SWAT team apparently dispatched from Oslo arrived on the island and shot him. In the meantime, he murdered at least 80 kids.
    http://www.powerlineblog.com/archive...postscript.php

    I don't want to ever hear again from some jackass about how we don't "need" guns because the police are going to guarantee the safety of our parks, our schools, and our children.

  3. #3
    Member  
    Join Date
    08-04-08
    Location
    eastern Massachusetts
    Posts
    8,699
    dressed as a policeman and heavily armed, took a boat to the island, ordered teenagers to assemble around him
    I'm rapidly zeroing in on old-fartdom, but next time I hear some punk of a whippersnapper say, "Question Authority!" I'm going to let him know I agree.

    So, how would I do that, exactly?

    In any case, my prayers.

  4. #4
    Administrator   
    Join Date
    11-19-03
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    13,086
    Absolutely, what a terrible crime, punish the madman responsible to the fullest extent of the law - do they have the death penalty in Norway?
    If total government control equals safety, why are prisons so dangerous?

    http://czforumsite.info/

  5. #5
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    05-09-05
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    410
    Nope, no death penalty. I'm guessing Norway's got a weak-sauce system, just like Sweden, but I can't see this guy having the chance of ever getting out of prison alive. He'll rot in jail.
    Live Free & Die Free.

  6. #6
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    06-09-10
    Posts
    416

    In light of our news on Gun Walker

    What I want to know is how automatic weapons and explosives were acquired in a gun control environment like Europe?

    Are they not more strict than New York for example?

  7. #7
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    11-18-10
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    448
    Their point is moot. Already there are big restrictions on ownership of automatic firearms. -- particularly in Europe of all places....

    Yes I know that's not what they mean but its still funny in a sad sort of way.

  8. #8
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    07-03-07
    Location
    Linn County, Iowa
    Posts
    3,404
    What lesson is there to learn? I propose the lesson is that there is evil in this world and, as hard as we may try, we cannot legislate it away. I believe that the more people that realize this the easier it will be to reach a free society. I'm not saying we can achieve perfection but by respecting the liberties of the individual we can achieve a more perfect community, establish justice, ensure tranquility, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our descendents. I read something like that somewhere, just not sure where.

    The more restrictions we place on personal liberty the more the thugs and governments in this world can take advantage of this and cause us greater harm. Taken to an extreme the distinction between the thugs and the government becomes irrelevant. This person (or group) was allowed to produce such death and destruction precisely because the government had little respect for the lives of the individual. The thug, sharing this disrespect for life, liberty, and property, took advantage of this.
    You can have free speech or you can have income taxes but you cannot have both.

  9. #9
    Member  
    Join Date
    12-17-09
    Location
    EEU
    Posts
    2,557
    @Jesse
    If you have money you can buy almost anything. Albanian mafia, which is booming courtesy of US meddling, as it has it's own mob state in Kosovo sells anything and everything. Women, drugs, guns, RPG's.

    Albanian mafia is everywhere, and no doubt if you took time to find the right person, they'd be willing to sell you automatic weaponry or explosives.

  10. #10
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    06-12-10
    Location
    Kodiak, Alaska
    Posts
    3,469
    The shooter had three legally owned weapons, none of them automatic. He was a farmer who could buy fertilizer without raising eyebrows, thus the bomb.

  11. #11
    Administrator   
    Join Date
    11-19-03
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    13,086
    My point was, regardless of the firearms used, the first thing CNN editors did was call for more gun control world wide, ala ATT treaty, just like an IANSA shill would do. The latest story I read from CNN said the shooter faces, get this, 21 years in prison, for "terrorism". 92 deaths - that's less than 3 months to serve per murder.
    If total government control equals safety, why are prisons so dangerous?

    http://czforumsite.info/

  12. #12
    Administrator   
    Join Date
    11-19-03
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    13,086
    Also from a new CNN news story,
    The acting national police chief, Sveinung Sponheim, told reporters in Oslo that the gun used to shoot the campers was an automatic weapon and that undetonated explosives were found on the island after the attack.
    http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/europe...=BN1&hpt=hp_t1
    If total government control equals safety, why are prisons so dangerous?

    http://czforumsite.info/

  13. #13
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    06-12-10
    Location
    Kodiak, Alaska
    Posts
    3,469
    The report I saw said he had three weapons registered to him including a rifle, shotgun and handgun. The only one specifically identified was a Glock.

    "Automatic" weapons means anything scary-looking to a police spokesman. Doubtless, he could have converted a semi to automatic, but we'll probably never know because the media will call it a machine gun no matter what it actually was.

  14. #14
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    04-13-04
    Location
    Tampa Bay area
    Posts
    1,371

    What I Learned

    The only person thus far implicated in the attack was a Norwegian citizen who may have been associated with [B]right-wing political activists/B], but it is not clear whether he was working alone or why he conducted such a merciless assault.

    The above was quoted from the CNN article.
    What I learned is that all insane mass murderers are Right winger, according to the Media.

  15. #15
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    06-05-03
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    1,698
    he was a mcvey type person.

  16. #16
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    12-30-02
    Location
    Deep in the Ozarks
    Posts
    11,339
    The latest story I read from CNN said the shooter faces, get this, 21 years in prison, for "terrorism". 92 deaths - that's less than 3 months to serve per murder.
    Apparently he gets a volume discount.

  17. #17
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    01-13-11
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    156
    To me ( and I know this is early to say this but ) this sounds like another failure of the Gun Free Zone! mentality.
    I don't live in fear, I live in Alabama!!!

  18. #18
    Administrator   
    Join Date
    11-19-03
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    13,086
    Gun free country.
    To own a gun in Norway, one must document a use for the gun. By far, the most common grounds for civilian ownership are hunting and sports shooting, in that order. Other needs can include special guard duties or self defense, but the first is rare and the second is practically never accepted as a reason for gun ownership...There is no apparent public desire to introduce a concealed carry permit at this point in time, and there is no such license available to civilians.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Norway
    I know, Wiki is a horrible resource, but it as all I could find at short notice.
    If total government control equals safety, why are prisons so dangerous?

    http://czforumsite.info/

  19. #19
    Member  
    Join Date
    12-17-09
    Location
    EEU
    Posts
    2,557
    Gun free country? It has something like 1.5 million guns per 5 million people. Pretty respectable.

    Shame about their lack of carry laws though.

  20. #20
    Administrator   
    Join Date
    11-19-03
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    13,086
    If it's at home locked up and disassembled, then it is of no use whatsoever.
    If total government control equals safety, why are prisons so dangerous?

    http://czforumsite.info/

  21. #21
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    12-26-02
    Location
    Occupied Montanistan
    Posts
    11,489
    They should have had a law against dressing up like a policeman
    Governments don't live together. People live together.

  22. #22
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    04-23-06
    Posts
    472
    Quote from PBS last night "Right wing Christian who hates Muslims." Yeah... And he seems to have acted "alone."

    AFT supply the guns? Begs the question if "somebody" is out to get you are you being paranoid?'

  23. #23
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    10-27-06
    Posts
    2,196
    Tallpine said:
    They should have had a law against dressing up like a policeman
    Dressing as LEO or military is nothing new, and a common tactic in parts of the world during an attack.

    It was not uncommon in the Iraq conflict, is done often in Afghanistan and neighboring Pakistan by insurgents, and is commonly done in Mexico by the cartels. Just to name a few locations the US is involved with. In Mexico it is a really effective strategy because the actual police and military often hide their faces and identity, so cartel members doing the same thing can have all the benefits of being police and remain anonymous at the same time.

    Checkpoints manned by fake police that open fire on targets is a common strategy.
    It is also used to gain cooperation during many kidnappings and murders. For example going to homes, 'arresting' individuals, and then taking them away. The victims often cooperate thinking everything will get sorted out later, and taking on multiple armed men in uniform who are police is a bad idea.
    Their bodies are often found in mass graves. Sometimes with signs of torture.

    Many of these organized groups even paint vehicles to look official for their attacks.

    JERRY said:
    he was a mcvey type person.
    I would disagree. While there is plenty to dislike about someone blowing up a building and killing people, McVeigh targeted the regional HQ of the people responsible for the Waco siege. The HQ of a bunch of armed LEO.

    By contrast this Norway murderer targeted a bunch of unarmed teens at a political camp hosted by the political party he didn't like.

    While both may be killers committing domestic acts of terrorism, there is certainly a clear difference.

  24. #24
    Senior Member  
    Join Date
    06-05-03
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    1,698
    he was motivated politcally, and mcvey murdered a bunch of children in OKC, and this norseman bomded a government building too, or are we only focusing on the shooting he did?

  25. #25
    Administrator   
    Join Date
    11-19-03
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    13,086
    The Norwiegan killer is a murderer of defenseless people, same as McVeigh, regardless of who targeted what. They both belong in the same flaming cell down below - Timmy has the top bunk waiting for him.
    Apparently it took Norweigan police 90 minutes to show up to the scene of the shooting. 40 minutes of that was trying to locate boats, because their helo was not on standby.
    If total government control equals safety, why are prisons so dangerous?

    http://czforumsite.info/

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •