That's a lot of ammunition!

[Jamie B]

Now you are trying to make friends with me. At the risk of falling into a rant I won't expand on the subject.

Don't flatter yourself; he is just right.

[NEOKShooter]

DHS ammo buys now redacted as N’west activists react

The Department of Homeland Security is now redacting information about a large scale ammunition shopping list, according to Press TV, and that will raise even more eyebrows among Northwest gun rights activists now discussing the purchase on several forums.

http://www.examiner.com/article/dhs-...id=db_articles

I suppose all future ammunition purchases will be classified. What were they thinking, letting the masses know what the government was planning. Since national security is the only reason for government secrecy, let's see what they come up with how so many millions of rounds of ammo in the homeland are for national security.

[230RN]

Let the record reflect this line went without comment.

Let the record reflect this line went without comment.

Even though I saw it because I had my comment glasses on.

Terry, 230RN

[Dave Workman]

I got a call from a guy claiming to be in Italy with the Air Force, also claiming to be a liberal, and he was upset about a CCRKBA e-mail alert about legislation sponsored by Frank Lautenberg that aims to "crack down" on ammunition sales.

Anytime anyone purchases more than 1,000 rounds, under this bill, it would be reported.

Maybe it's time to report DHS. Oh, wait, I already did that.

750M rounds is lots of bang for the buck.

If DHS classifies their future ammo sales, that might be grounds for a lawsuit and pubic disclosure action.

If the government doesn't want me to know how much ammunition it has, that goes both ways.

[Jamie B]

If the government doesn't want me to know how much ammunition it has, that goes both ways.

That's the line for the year! Very good.

[armoredman]

Sounds like an excellent idea.

[Old Grump]

1000 rounds is reportable? Ye Gads, I'll never get off report. They can just print up a copy of the report with my name on it and every month fill in that months purchases. Does this mean since we have to be good little Serf's and report meekly to the royal treasury and armory what we are putting in the bank, growing in our garden and stocking up in our ammo closet that they are going to stop applying executive privilege to their criminal activities and come clean with the little things like their fitness and qualifications to hold high positions in the American government.

[berettaprofessor]

7.62 X 39? 230RN who says that's for domestic use? Probably going to the contras...or whatever the equivalent is today.

[Selena]

1000 rounds is reportable? Ye Gads, I'll never get off report. They can just print up a copy of the report with my name on it and every month fill in that months purchases. Does this mean since we have to be good little Serf's and report meekly to the royal treasury and armory what we are putting in the bank, growing in our garden and stocking up in our ammo closet that they are going to stop applying executive privilege to their criminal activities and come clean with the little things like their fitness and qualifications to hold high positions in the American government.

Hi Old Grump...

Technically... under the decision rendered in Wickard v. Filburn since vegetables are an item of interstate trade you are required to report to the USDA what you are growing in your garden.

[Old Grump]

Hi Old Grump...

Technically... under the decision rendered in Wickard v. Filburn since vegetables are an item of interstate trade you are required to report to the USDA what you are growing in your garden.

I know but I wasn't referring to that but to the mandatory reporting requirement of home garden produce by some California cities. Part of their waste gas production, solid waste production and water usage survey and the effect it has on the water quality. I don't want to tell anybody in his official capacity as a government official if I am growing parsnips or squash or Bermuda onions and how much. Just another list of stuff I have which would be on their records and I don't like it. Carrots, bullets or savings account, it's none of their business.

[Selena]

I know but I wasn't referring to that but to the mandatory reporting requirement of home garden produce by some California cities. Part of their waste gas production, solid waste production and water usage survey and the effect it has on the water quality. I don't want to tell anybody in his official capacity as a government official if I am growing parsnips or squash or Bermuda onions and how much. Just another list of stuff I have which would be on their records and I don't like it. Carrots, bullets or savings account, it's none of their business.

Take care sir, you are dangerously close to violation of the 'government knows best act' of 2001.

Seriously, if you receive one of these forms give it priority unless you want to find out just how anal the great white father in Washington can really be.

Mandatory USDA "survey"

[Old Grump]

Take care sir, you are dangerously close to violation of the 'government knows best act' of 2001.

Seriously, if you receive one of these forms give it priority unless you want to find out just how anal the great white father in Washington can really be.

Mandatory USDA "survey"

I am to old and crotchety to give a damn what they think.

[Selena]

I am to old and crotchety to give a damn what they think.

We won't talk about old and crotchety, thank you very much. Somewhere my Dad got hold of some video files of dubious origin and I've spent most of the morning finding the proper codec to play the dumb things. Why anyone would want to watch a vid named "The Big Trail" is beyond me but I have to admit that John Wayne was kind of cute in 1930.

[ConstitutionCowboy]

For a much more clear picture of these purchases, I'd like to see a list of ammo purchases over the last 4 or 5 decades for comparison. If it were to be that these recent purchases were in line with previous purchases, I would imagine those previous purchases would be touted as examples showing that these recent purchases were "routine", benign, and innocuous. There has been not one mention of such a correlation. Could it be that these new purchases are in fact over the top?

Again, my conspiracy theoryometer remains in the red due to a lack of forthcoming relevant information.

Woody

[Johnny Dollar]

We won't talk about old and crotchety, thank you very much. Somewhere my Dad got hold of some video files of dubious origin and I've spent most of the morning finding the proper codec to play the dumb things. Why anyone would want to watch a vid named "The Big Trail" is beyond me but I have to admit that John Wayne was kind of cute in 1930.

The 23 year old Duke had just left USC when he signed on for The Big Trail. The flick flopped and so did Wayne. It took him 9 years and Director John Ford's faith to get him the role in Stagecoach in 1939.

That role made Wayne an "A" lister for the rest of his career. He never forgot the debt he owed to the great John Ford.

[Selena]

The 23 year old Duke had just left USC when he signed on for The Big Trail. The flick flopped and so did Wayne. It took him 9 years and Director John Ford's faith to get him the role in Stagecoach in 1939.

That role made Wayne an "A" lister for the rest of his career. He never forgot the debt he owed to the great John Ford.

You can go over to Dad's and watch them with him then. Out of 50 hours worth of vids I'm sure there is a classic in there somewhere. I've never heard of Tom Mix and am perfectly happy to have escaped before he was introduced.

[Dave Workman]

You can go over to Dad's and watch them with him then. Out of 50 hours worth of vids I'm sure there is a classic in there somewhere. I've never heard of Tom Mix and am perfectly happy to have escaped before he was introduced.

Tom Mix was a pallbearer at Wyatt Earp's funeral.

[Old Grump]

You can go over to Dad's and watch them with him then. Out of 50 hours worth of vids I'm sure there is a classic in there somewhere. I've never heard of Tom Mix and am perfectly happy to have escaped before he was introduced.

Boo Hiss, Tom Mix was a child hood hero in our house hold, the first two gun shooter and he really was a cowboy, knife thrower, trick rider and fortunately most of his films were silent because his singing...well he was no Gene Autry. First introduced to him in comic books and his radio show and then the movies.

[Selena]

Boo Hiss, Tom Mix was a child hood hero in our house hold, the first two gun shooter and he really was a cowboy, knife thrower, trick rider and fortunately most of his films were silent because his singing...well he was no Gene Autry. First introduced to him in comic books and his radio show and then the movies.

Let the record reflect that out of a profound and well earned respect for both Old Grump and Johnny Dollar I declined comment.

[ConstitutionCowboy]

Boo Hiss, Tom Mix was a child hood hero in our house hold, the first two gun shooter and he really was a cowboy, knife thrower, trick rider and fortunately most of his films were silent because his singing...well he was no Gene Autry. First introduced to him in comic books and his radio show and then the movies.

Tom Mix was also a bartender at the Bluebell Saloon in Guthrie, Oklahoma, for a while. I've been there several times before it suffered some fire damage. It's being restored. Thankfully, the original bar and tile floor were unscathed by the fire.

Woody

[230RN]

We might want to familiarize ourselves with this related subject of "hoarding":

http://millennium-ark.net/News_Files...rders/EOs.html

This ^ was brought up for discussion on the Hawaiian site (2aHawaii dot com) at

http://2ahawaii.com/index.php?topic=3338.0

if you care to browse the whole thread on the subject.

My comment in that thread was:

Hmmm. This thread has activated the hairs on the back of my neck. Pardon my paranoid, suspicious. but historically alert old mind.

What about ammo? I know many of us have more than a week's supply of ammunition and loading components on hand. Can we claim that we shoot 5000 rd of .22 LR in a week? Or use 5000 large rifle primers in a week?

Hmmm. Not to put ideas in the anti-gunners' heads, but if I can think of this in my little senior citizen's apartment in Colorado, why can't they think of it in the confines of their anti-gunner ratholes?

We all know about the President's remarks about putting gun control efforts "under the radar," and this stuff strikes me as a perfect back-door-but-hold-in-reserve gun control (or ammunition control, which is the same thing) ploy.

(My Reply #21)

I post this just to fill out a little bit of the picture on ammo reporting. It also brings up the question of "Can they nail you for hoarding if you've essentially been required to report your own large purchases?"

Terry, 230RN

[gc70]

For a much more clear picture of these purchases, I'd like to see a list of ammo purchases over the last 4 or 5 decades for comparison. If it were to be that these recent purchases were in line with previous purchases, I would imagine those previous purchases would be touted as examples showing that these recent purchases were "routine", benign, and innocuous. There has been not one mention of such a correlation. Could it be that these new purchases are in fact over the top?

It is difficult to reach back decades when agencies were making separate purchases. It is far easier to look at purchases since most federal law enforcement was concentrated in DHS. This 1/4/2007 press release discusses DHS ammunition contracts with ATK totaling about $105 million; the quantity of ammunition is not mentioned but I would guess around 420 million rounds at a quarter each.

[Suwannee Tim]

I have a buddy who works for DHS, he is a Federal Protective Service agent. He gets all the 5.56mm and 40 caliber ammo he wants to shoot and that's a considerable amount of ammo. He was bellyaching because he couldn't get 7.62 and had to buy it himself. Maybe that's why they are buying 7.62, so the guys don't have to buy their own. These guys don't have "practice ammo" and "premium ammo". They only got one kind, you guess which.

[NEOKShooter]

The fact is the US Government can't keep a secret. We were tracking OBL by his satellite cell phone long before 9/11, the NYT blew that operation. We were holding Al Qaeda terrorists in secret prisons in eastern Europe, the NYT blew that operation. We were tracking their money and the NYT blew that operation. And yet "CIA ran 9/11". I personally admire my restraint in not calling wildly irrational lunatics wildly irrational lunatics more often that I do. I don't do it very often because to quote a rock and roll song "you cannot argue with a crazy mind." Certainly and not keep my own sanity which is fragile enough without additional stresses and strains.

The NYT didn't reveal anything that any 12 year old couldn't already tell. There were no surprises in any of this. In fact, Bin Laden's family purchased the Iridium satellite phone system at fire sale prices from Motorola. The price of 50MM dollars comes to mind. Even before the failure that led to the purchase, the Bin Laden family was involved. I can't find the article on the sale to Bin Laden Group but here's an article still showing that Bin Laden's brother was on the board of the still-Motorola-run version of Iridium:

http://www.reuters.com/finance/stock...ymbol=IRIDQ.PK

Osama Bin Laden may have chosen to live in caves but he was not a cave man.